Listening Skills, Assertiveness, and Entrepreneurship Strategies

Hello, everyone. Welcome to another edition of the Empowering Entrepreneurs podcast. I'm Glenn Harper.

I'm Julie Smith.

Drinking hot coffee today. It's a 100,000,000 of trees out.

Yeah. I mean, it's real cool in here. I think it's suitable.

It is. I get I get used to the to the warm stuff. But, yeah, we're gonna all live through this, I think, even though, people are losing their minds. But as long as we got AC, I think we'll be all right. Well, we've got a great guest lined up today. I'd like to introduce you to Dr. Carrie Graham, owner of Carrie Graham Consulting, where one can learn how to develop and implement training programs to get the results you've been questing for. She She has a PhD in philosophy, learning leadership, and educational policy that focuses on adult learning. Who knew is it that as adults, we need to keep learning and developing? Carrie is still an influencer inside academia, but she enjoys the freedom and satisfaction of being in the real world consulting with companies and individuals.

She has had many of her findings published and really enjoys teaching others. She could have just chilled out in the safe world of academia, but no. She decided to take her passion to the marketplace and is currently enjoying both sides of the spectrum, motivating and helping others achieve their goals and what gets her up in the morning. Thanks, Keri, for being on our show.

Thank you so much, Glenn and Julie, for having me. I really appreciate it. I am also in the depths of hell with the heat, but I'm excited to be here with you in the air kit in the air conditioning.

A true professional. You're not even breaking a sweat. That's what we're talking about. That's fantastic.

Now, Glenn's got a lot of questions for you because apparently, his stalking, wasn't very good with you. No. He claims that you're hard to find out there on the Internet.

Yeah. I've I've found all your aliases, but I didn't find the real you out there. So I guess the first thing we like to do is find out where where were you born and raised at.

Absolutely. Absolutely. I am a New Englander, born and bred, from Connecticut. I missed my 4 seasons. I had the opportunity to live across the country, once I got out of high school. And so I am landed outside of Charlotte right now. And like I said, I'm in the depths of hell even in the morning. It is just ridiculous.

Ridiculous.

Hard to believe people choose to live south, but thank god for air conditioning.

But I think the the heat is going all the way through. Even New England's getting a little bit of that heat. So you wouldn't have been safe this time, I don't think.

No. I don't think so. I talked to my family, and it seems this year, they've either gotten rain or heat. 2 things that, you know, it it has a purpose. It has a purpose. That's all I tell myself.

Now growing up in Connecticut, did your, did your parents were they have real jobs or they work for, did they were they self employed? How did that work out?

Oh, no. I, grew up in a household of corporate individuals. Uh-huh. You know, Hartford being the at the time, the insurance capital, everyone in my family worked in insurance, and that's all I knew growing up. And so the entrepreneurial journey, was definitely something that I I experienced on my own. And it's it's been great. It's been great. But, you know, I'm sure many peep many of your listeners can attest that when you are on a journey that no one else has taken, you're at a loss for, like, okay.

How did who who can I role model off of or from, and where do I get different pieces of information? So it's been a journey. It's been a journey.

Yeah. You're, everything's you're crazy. It's a very lonely place. Your family looks at you, like, why would you go into insurance? But and here you are. Were you when you were young, did you, you know, hustle? Julie always what's that say? You're selling what?

Selling painting rocks, selling lemonade. Were you doing any of those fun things? Bracelets or the new new thing, I think?

Yeah. I think so. No. I actually so, you know, some people would say, man, Carrie, you're really boring growing up. Right? Like, I I was an only child until I was shy. And then I excuse me. I actually got my college degree in sports medicine, my undergraduate degree. So I I worked with athletes, as a health care provider.

And even with that, it's funny you say that, Glenn, because as an athletic trainer, my family would always say, what what are you doing? What is that? Like, 10 years in, what what is that, Carrie?

What does that mean?

Yeah. Yeah. Like, why why don't you get a real job? My uncle would always say. And so I'm I'm at it again, right, with what what do you do again? You you own your own business. I get that. But what what do you do? So it's it's the path that I've chosen, to always just do something different, and and it has been so great for me. It really has.

So how did you go from athletic training to where you are? You know, what would what did that look like? Because athletic training is a I mean, that's a skill set all in its own.

It is. It is. It is. It it was great. It was absolutely incredible. I worked in division 1 athletics. Not a fan of the Buckeyes, but we'll save that for another conversation.

We seem to be having technical difficulties. I'm not sure what's going on here. No. You Yukon's got a great program. We're we we can't diss them at all.

Yeah. So I I worked in Division 1 Athletics, you know, traveled with teams and such, and then I worked as a professor. So I spent the bulk of my professional career as a university professor teaching future athletic trainers, and it was I kept going to these required trainings. These required, whether it because I was a state employee or to maintain my credential, and that's when I realized, like, this can be better. I've spent 1,000, and I've lost a lot of, you know, personal time at these trainings, and they're not good. Something needs to change. And then with the pandemic, I I realized, like, okay. I'm being downsized.

I have a Ph. PhD in adult learning. What what's next? What can I do next? And that's when I decided, alright. I'm gonna put athletic training behind me and focus on on supporting other businesses, particularly small businesses that don't know how to put together a training and and get them to where they need to be.

Well, can I go back?

That's a that's a hard pivot.

That is. And and that's what I'm I'm like, so you're in sports training, and you're at Western Michigan University with the master's in education. Yeah. Then all of a sudden, you decide, hey, I'm gonna go to Yukon and get a PhD in philosophy. Like, that's very different. Why did you how did you pick that?

So my education was always like the topper, I'll say. So I again, I was at living out in Seattle working at the University of Washington app in athletics. I had some some family life experiences and, oddly enough, coincided with me being recruited to Yukon to teach as an athletic trainer. So it was an opportunity to get back to Connecticut, be with my family, closer to my family, And that's when my teaching journey started. And so I was honing my skills of how to put together a curriculum effectively. How do I motivate people so that they do the thing I need them to do, especially as someone who's shy and reserved. So number of years after that, and I realized, like, oh, I should probably get a PhD while I'm here. Right? I already got a master's.

Like, this is what the academic world is telling me to get this PhD. So I'm looking around. I didn't want a PhD in kinesiology, and I I landed in athletic, athletic training. I landed in adult learning and leadership development, and that's where, like, it was as if I took on the dark sunglasses and someone turned the lights on. It it really touched my heart and my personal life experience, and that's that's what what got me started.

And I'm guessing your parents were like, now what are you doing? Right?

Yes. Yet again. Again.

Yet again. Yet again. They're like, Carrie, yeah. I learned what I needed to learn in school. Like, why do adults need to learn things? And so it was, you know, educating them, my whole family actually educating them again on what I do and why it matters and such. So but yeah.

It's funny, you know, when you deal with, athletes and people that are trying to train athletes, that's a whole different mindset. Yes. Even though it's probably very similar to the top corporate execs, like they have to they're they're, you know, thoroughbreds. They gotta they gotta do a Yeah. Certain thing. But that probably is a different, way you communicate to those people to bring out the best in them Because, again, you're just trying to find that commonality, and then I don't wanna say exploit it, but that's what you're trying to do, get the best out of them. So that seems like that would be an, I don't wanna discount it, but it seems like that was an easy transition

It was.

Because it it seemed like it was in the same same vein. But still, to wanna go back to school for another, what, 47 years to get a PhD just seems exhausting, right? Trying to work a real job, do the training, and go back to school. How did you navigate all that?

Wait. 1st, I wanna say, like, you're you're reserved and shy, but as an athletic trainer, you're, they're like, if they're going to play a game or not hinges on your opinion almost. So you cannot be shy and reserved. Like, you have to have almost a type a backbone. So did you maybe did a little bit of that come out going through the athletic training?

It did. It did. And you are spot on, Julie. Like, it it really was a it was a journey in and of itself. Because when I say I was shy, like, I really wanted to play sports, and my mother was an advocate of it, but I could not like, I couldn't bring myself to be in a group and have to engage in that level of dynamic. But to your point, I had found I realized what it was one day I was in undergrad. I realized if I wanna be successful, I have to do this. Like, I have to do the thing that is uncomfortable.

And I'm a small person. Right? So I'm 54, so relatively short. But, you know, I'm working with athletes who tower over me and coaches, no less, that tower over me, and they're all accustomed to being loud. And it was it was a journey. It was a con a daily learning experience of me being uncomfortable and learning how to stand my ground. Not only stand my ground, but do it confidently, be assertive, take risks, like, take on an alter ego. But, really, for me, it was I always wanted to remain authentic. I always wanted to be who I am, right, and not change any of that.

So it's it hasn't been easy. Please don't misunderstand. It has not been easy. And then being a black woman working in college athletics, it's, at that time in the late nineties, rare. So it it's it is it reflects where I am now, which, Glenn, to your point, like, working in the corp consulting in the corporate sector, working with people who are at the top of their professional career, who have very high expectations. It's for me, I look at it as, no. That's the common thread. And I know what I know.

I'm confident in what I know. And so I I have no problems now telling people, no. You're doing that wrong, and this is why and how you need to change it. And so it's the same thing. I got great training and athletic training learning on. Early on, I had coaches yell at me. I had players yell at me, like, the gamut. The gamut.

The the abuse is rampant, but that's how it builds you tough. Exactly. So a question because, again, a lot of entrepreneurs, there's always this ceiling, there's this chasm that they just cannot overcome and they wait and wait and wait till they finally just by default they have to go do that hard thing. How long was that timetable from when you were like, man, I just am not comfortable with this, till you said, finally, I've just gotta do it. Was that, like, a month, 6 years? You know, how long did that take for you to finally said, that's it. You got up in the morning and said, I'm going

for it. Yeah. I it didn't when you look at the a timeline, the average person would say, oh, wow. You did that pretty quickly. But if you understand the world of division 1 and then an elite athlete athletics, the windows are pretty tight. Right? So you have to do things pretty quickly. So for me, in internally, it felt like forever, but I remember think here's a great example. I was told, okay.

Cover this game on your own as a, like, a senior in college. And, I kept telling myself, you have to go over and introduce yourself to the coach of the other team. I was terrified. And so, like, all morning, I'm giving myself a pep talk. You can do this. You can do this. I'm standing on the sideline of the soccer field. You can do this.

Just do it. I'm sweating. Just walk over there. I walk over across the the pitch just confident, head up, firm handshake, like, do all the things. I did it. It was great. It was over and done with. Fast forward, as an educator, you have to give this presentation.

You're prepared. You're ready. Just go do it. You've you're I'm at a conference. You have to get up on stage. Carrie, don't think about it. Just do it. Don't don't pass out.

Don't sweat to death. Like, just walk up the stairs, up the podium, get take a deep breath. You can do this. And so and even now it's pick up the phone, make that call with a client, follow-up. You can do this. So there there are things that just pop up, and I realized, like, I have to just do it. It is uncomfortable. I feel like I'm dying inside.

But if I want whatever the end outcome is, I know that I I have to do whatever it takes to get there. So it's not like years for me. It hasn't been years. It's like

That's it. What is

happening in the moment. Yeah.

So you alluded to in COVID, like, it really may push you to make the jump. But was there a defining moment that some you know, you talked about going to the trainings and stuff, but was there a specific training or specific situation that just kind of pushed you off the cliff?

Yes, Julie. I got fired. And so That'll

do it. That'll do it.

You know? That will do it. So, I mean, full transparency, I lost my job. Right? So my I was teaching at a different institution, one in North Carolina, and they decided to get rid of the athletic training education program. And I had so I knew it was coming. I was on the job market. No one was hiring, and then COVID with all of the shutdown. So I'm like, if they weren't hiring before COVID, here we are. I can't like and I remember, I sitting at my dining room table, I turned in my final grades, and I'm like, what am I gonna do? I have enough money for a couple months.

I gotta do something. And I remember praying, like, god, what am I supposed to do? I got all these years of experience in this, and I got a PhD in this over here. And it I was like, this is my opportunity. This is my chance to use the PhD that I'm really loving and digging. And so it it was I would say it was that day sitting at my dining room table.

And did you have a mentor or anybody who maybe had made that jump that you could kinda confide in, you know, bounce ideas off of, or was it just you alone at your dining room table making all these decisions?

It was me at my dining room table making all the decisions, honestly. And so I'll share this because I think for listeners, it's really important to recognize. I there's a reason I'm about to say what I'm gonna say. As a black woman working in college athletics and then working teaching in the academy, so at the university level. There was always the expectation of me working on someone else's agenda, doing something for someone else. All of my final decisions have to be approved by someone. I remember sitting at my dining room table, like putting together my biz my consulting business, and I thought, oh, I have a decision to make. Who and immediately, I picked up my phone and said, who can I call? And in that moment, I couldn't find anyone to call.

Because I'm like, who know who's own their own business and knows about this budgeting thing? I looked, I there was no one I could think of to call, and I thought, Carrie, this is your business. You get to decide. Why do you need anyone to validate you? And that's what I was I recognizes I had an entire professional life that relied on me being validated by someone else. And it was always men. And this was my chance. This was my chance. And as a Christian, I I said, well, I'm already have been validated by God. Like, I'm I'm everything that I need to be, figure it out and make the decision and move forward.

And so that that moment was the number one turning point for me is recognizing that I don't need anyone else's validation to run my business.

You know, it's you hit about, like, 37 nuggets here in the last 2 minutes here, but I'm gonna try to summarize them for listeners because this is what what what what matters. So the in my opinion, and just listening to you, and this is the takeaways, I think, is, you know, when you apply yourself to be the best at something that you can possibly be, which is earning your doctorate, automatically, you're the authority in the room because it says doctor. Right. You don't need anybody to tell you are or you're not. It doesn't matter if you're male, female, black, white. It doesn't matter. You own the space. That hard part is what you had to do is that most calls to action and most entrepreneurs and people just generally in life, they will not get off their merry-go-round unless their backs against the wall, they have no choice, and they have to make the decision.

So you the losing the employment, you had to make the decision. But the really cool thing is that when you did and you realized when you picked up the phone to call somebody and you realized, wait a minute, it's always been me. It's always Yeah. You you gave yourself the empowerment to be the best you could be. You didn't need anybody else to it. Now all those other people helped you get where you are and all those things and trained you and did and whatever those things are, you've earned it with all the things. But the moment when you said it's about you doing it, that is tremendously empowering. And now, there is no help desk.

It's you every time. And so as an entrepreneur, every one of you out there, it isn't there is no help desk. I mean, you can hire people to help and consult and all those things, but, ultimately, the decisions are gonna be yours and you gotta live and die by those. And at that point in time, you felt alive probably, and you probably felt different than your entire career.

Yeah. Absolutely. And that's the key thing. It's the the recognition to keep going back to I have everything I need. And even, you know, I I am so blessed and and thankful that I do have a terminal degree. However, I don't like tech stuff. Like, I say it publicly all the time. I don't like the tech stuff.

I it makes me anxious and I can afford to pay someone to help me or do it for me. Like, that's the validity in it. Right? It's it's I don't have to be a master or a doctor of all things, but I need to know and fully and my skill set and and find the people that can fill those. So I you know, back to your original question, Julie, I wish I really wish I had a mentor on this entrepreneurial journey, and I was thinking about that recently. I've really never had a mentor. There have been people that I love who have, at different points of my life, that have I've turned to for spiritual support, emotional support. But to have a mentor, a professional mentor that's journeying the same path that I'm on. I have not actually had that.

I'm gonna flip I'm gonna flip the script then. Have you been able to mentor anyone knowing that there's such a need for that?

I have. I have. And it's so important to me to do that. So whenever I meet people who, regardless, I was gonna say who want to be on the journey that I'm on, but that's not actually true. It's really whomever I meet whenever I whenever they mention a need or they ask a question, I make it my business to support them where they are and in the ways in which they are asking asking for because I know how important it is, and I know the consequence of not having it. Right? So I think as an entrepreneur, when we have these public discussions, there's there's typically the focus on the inspirational parts of it. But it there's also a very lonely piece of entrepreneurship. And, you know, it it can be taxing on anyone intellectually, emotionally.

It has an impact on your relationships, on your physical health. Right? Like, I started working out again because I was at 51, I was becoming, like, just dull. Like, mentally, like, I was in a fog all the time. And so working out, again, has helped clear that, and I'm able to do my work with more focus. And so you need mentors. You you real and if not and this was from my my doctoral research. If not a mentor, create your own network. That is equally important.

Now did I have a network? Absolutely. I was able to find other women who were on the same journey, and it was really helpful. But, yeah, if you don't have a mentor at least and can't find a mentor, at least surround yourself with like minded supportive people.

I'm gonna go on a limb here and say that probably all the people you came across through your careers, you probably got a little bit of a nugget from all of them. Nothing like succinct that was like, here's what you do, but you probably got these little pieces from everybody, and you were able to probably develop some consensus of that because, again, your mindset and your skill set is observing, learning, processing, and then coming back with solutions. I suspect you didn't have one mentor, you probably had a gazillion, but nobody put it together. Guess who had to put it together? You. And so once you put it together, here we are And now, you know what to do. And again, the entrepreneurial is just, it's a very lonely place. People just don't understand. Other entrepreneurs do.

But the other key thing that I think you did is you don't have to be an expert in everything. Once you realize there's something you can offload that you didn't need to be an expert in, you just have to make decisions when the information is provided to you. You probably say that hour a day, and guess what you did? You did something productive. You didn't Facebook. You went out and you worked out. And then you better yourself some more. So Are

you talking about delegation?

Yeah. But it's very hard to do for entrepreneurs. We we just hate it. Right? Because we don't trust anybody. Right? So that's a normal thing. So you gotta take those baby steps and then you follow-up. And again, your personality types are all important, right? We all know that. And some people can do it, some people can't, and some people will learn it.

But as long as you're moving forward, you're you're you're gonna be okay.

That's it. That's it. And sometimes, you're moving your forward movement movement is fast, and other times, it is literally at a snail's pace, but recognizing that. And for me, that was a lesson I learned in the last couple years is that, okay, this journey of owning a business, it there are periods where things are moving so quickly, and then there are periods where it just moves slower and both are okay. Both of them are okay.

But and another cool thing is, you know, my my dad told me this a long time ago, and it's it's it's held true. Wherever you're at, you're there for a reason. You belong there. So don't think that you didn't earn the spot to be there or you shouldn't be there. If you're somewhere, you've earned the right to be there. Represent, do your best, and don't worry about anything else. It'll all be okay. It always is okay.

But if you go in there and don't seize the day on that, that's on you. When I say you, meaning any entrepreneur. So if you're doing something, prepare, be the best, you've earned the right to be there, and execute. And it sometimes you win, sometimes you I shouldn't say we we never fail. Right? We don't use the f word. You just it didn't work out. You Didn't

lose. We just pivot.

Right. There you go.

Yeah. Didn't work out. You know, I I really appreciate you saying that because, people often say, what's the best piece of advice that you've ever gotten and and from who? And for me, it was from my mom. You know? Again, corporate world, you know, that household. And she the advice she would always say is, well, Carrie, do your best. Like and it would be, that's it. Like, minimal explanation. It was just, oh, okay.

That's what you wanna do? Oh, okay. Well, do your best.

What's that mean?

And to hear you say that, that's what your dad told you. Like, it it didn't use I didn't use to get it. And now I'm like, yes, wherever I am, all I all that I can do is my best.

Show up.

And it is good enough.

You show up. Yep. If you're there, you might as well do your best because you get maybe the one shot. Do you have a in in your world, when you're trying to acquire clients and looking for them, you know, I was I love this question is is there, like, a person out there, a company, an individual, you know, like, man, if I could just be their coach, if I could just get engaged by them to help them out, I could rock their world and make them way better than they are. Do you have, like, somebody like that that you're like you just been shooting for and just really would like to go acquire them?

Yeah. I would say it's a business. It's a business who provides it's a business who, in their mission statement, they say that they value their employees, and they talk about how great their employees are to their business the success of their business. But when you look inside of that business, the employees don't feel that way. So there's a disconnect. That is the type of business that I'm I mean, a lot of places are like that, but it's a a business that, like, you read their mission, and it's it gives you all the feel goods. But you talk to people within for evidence of that, you know, that it's being carried out and it's not. And the reason I say that is because we spend so much time at work, so many hours of the day at work.

And when you are depleted at your job, you then go home to your loved ones, and you are not your full self because you've been depleted at work. You're not you leave, and you're not your full self or your community or even for yourself. I don't want I've been in that position, and I don't want that for anyone. So if I can, behind the scenes, help businesses provide a better quality of life for their employees, I am all about it. All about it.

Go ahead.

Well, I'm I'm gonna go backwards. So if you have something on this. So you're sitting at your dining room table. You make this definitive decision. This is what you're doing. You're making a business plan or whatever's going through your mind or whatever you're doing. How do you acquire your first your first client?

My first client, I I was in a group. So I had joined again the way things aligned. Someone that I used to I used to teach with had just left the institution. And I reached out to her for whatever reason, and she goes, you know, I'm gonna start my own business, and I'm in this group. What are you gonna do now that you're not working there anymore? And I thought, oh, well, you know, maybe this group could help me. So my first client, I just made a post in this group. I made an announcement in this group that this is something that I'm going to do and that I can help them with if they're interested. That's where my first client came from.

And my first number of clients came from that group, and it became a journey of, okay, how can I seek my client base outside of, you know, this initial group? And and that was another opportunity for me to grow, you know, learn some skills, learn how to network, learn about marketing, and move forward. So every point along the journey, I view it as an opportunity to grow and expand. Yeah.

Alright. I'm gonna jump forward. And and you said this, the ideal client or your dream client is again, it's not like there's just somebody you see on TV and, like, man, I just like to get with them. It's more like it doesn't really it's not about that for you. It's about anyone that has this need. So in your experience, when you find a company where the mission statement, let's just say, doesn't reflect the reality of the situation, Is it a culture thing? Is it a management thing? Is it an owner thing? Where is the disconnect between what everybody wants and what they're getting? What is the most common thing you see?

I would say it's the lack of knowledge.

On which side? The

Yeah. It's it's the lack of knowledge on the businesses side. So and the reason I say that is because I've had clients who were in midsized businesses as well as coaches and everything in between. And it's often their perception of what an effective training program looks like, right, or an onboarding program or their group coaching program. It's their perception of, oh, well, I have to make these videos, and I need to give them a worksheet because there are these different styles of I read somewhere that there are these different styles of learning, or it's the, well, we wanna build motivation and enthusiasm, so we're gonna hire a comedian to come in and get everyone excited. Right? That edutainment as I call it. And so it's really people don't know best practices, and the best practices are not based on Google. They're they should be based on research, validated research.

They don't they're not aware of what those are to support learning and particularly learning for adults. And that's because I have that 25 years of experience and the PhD, I'm able to step in, assess their circumstances, and say, okay. These are the changes you should make.

No. It's not like somebody's intentionally or unintentionally, you know, trying to do something wrong. They just they just don't know. Right?

They just don't know.

How how long does it usually take from the time you engage with a client? And, again, this is just a little bit about your business, but just, again, the the the, impetus for change, like, from the time you engage with the client, they come to you, they got this problem, you go in, they think it's x, you look at it, it's really y, and the time you assess that and then implement that change. And by the time that And by the time that client is, realizing the benefits of that change, what is the average timetable is that? Is that a a 3 weeks? Is it instant? Is it a year? Is it 6 months? How long does it usually take to get on the path at least?

Yeah. It's instant. And and I'm thinking about clients that have extensive information. And my client, this one financial adviser who had, like, 2 pages of information and that was it. And it's because of a conversation that I have with people upfront, like, once we've agreed to work together, we we talk about their audience in a way that's different than they've done it before. And so I would say in that regard, it's an instant like, oh, there's a different approach. There's a different perspective. And so they're because I'm presenting a new opportunity for them and a new perspective, they're like, yep.

Let's learn more. I wanna do more, and that that provides the foundation for our work together, but it always starts in the first conversation.

And, again, as an entrepreneur, you try to always figure out what is it that you really sell? Like, what's your product? You know, your product is not training. It's No. It's a thing. It's probably the self aculus act, acu I

believe what's the word?

Actualization. That's the word that goes, oh, there's a different way to skin a cat here. This is how we should do it. The the everything's always been there. They just didn't know how to look at it, and that's probably the probably the most fun you have doing with that with people because they probably have good training. It's probably okay. They just the different perspective is there.

Yeah. That is. And and, you know, people so often ask me, well, what industry do you work in? You have to, you know and then there's for your for your listeners, there's always this talk of, well, you have to niche down and you have to, like, figure out a an a industry, and I think it's a lie. Like, that's just my personal opinion, and I I don't. Right? So I have had clients who are across industries literally, But the folk the key theme that's consistent with all of them is they have content that they are trying to get their audience to implement. Like, that's the constant theme. It doesn't matter if you're in finance, if you're in Canadian Energy, if you are in online business, like branding, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter.

If you've got the content and you want people to use your content to change whether it's their skills or their behaviors or their thought patterns, whatever, we can do that. We can do that.

It seems like, you know, I'm just gonna do some snap judgments here because that's what I like to do, and everybody's on edge when I do that.

But You're shaking your head, Julie.

See, that's what I'm trying to say. So it seems like from your background of corporate stone cold killers in the industry going right into athletics where it's just like, you gotta get out there and, like, the intensity, you are do not convey that personality type. You're like, chill. You're just like, here's the deal. Like, did were you always this way or did you tone it down? Do you ratchet up if you need to? Because, again, you're just your delivery is just spot on, but there's no, like

So streamer cost. Snap judgment, but mine's not snap because I've been thinking about it the whole 42 minutes we've been speaking, is that she probably started out over here, which was even more chill than kind of what you see now. Introverted, I wanna say, the introvert part. And I think she probably has to ratchet up to here on certain occasions with certain individuals, and I'm guessing that came out in your d one athletic training days. So you you know where that can go. I'm guessing she lives right here in the middle. Right. And as she sees fit, she might go a little bit more this way or she might have to go all the what did you use ratchet? She might have to ratchet up to this this bar.

But I think she's learned to live somewhere in the middle, and I think her voice came out, you know, she learned your voice. Right? I don't think you probably had that in high school. She was able to learn what that was and how to use it and how to be confident and how to work through that. I think she lives somewhere right now.

But that's what I mean. That that it she doesn't have to have the screaming of a coach or the beat down in the boardroom to convey your point. Like, you're you have a different it seems like if this is your normal delivery, you have a different delivery, which I think is very helpful.

Well, you haven't made her have to ratchet up.

This is probably true. So what what do you what do you think about those assessments?

Well, I, you know, I I appreciate them, and you both are right. You're both are right. Like There's no

no no no no.

Wait wait wait. This is like a marriage counseling. Somewhere over here on the chalkboard. Okay. We can

we can go back to the I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. We can

we can definitely You

can see the, college athlete over here. Right?

Yeah. I totally see it. Totally see it. And I I honor that. I honor that. But, yes, it I do live in the middle. I do live in the middle. I I have the skills.

I developed the skills to be incredibly assertive, excuse me, when I need to.

She does didn't use the word ratchet, though.

I like I like the ratchet.

Ratchet it up.

Ratchet is good. You don't make me go out and crank this up. If I gotta crank

this up. 5 more times today in my day because that's, like, one of those words.

Frank it up.

I will I will say the one person maybe my family, but my husband sees the rats me ratcheting it up. Like, when I see something that gets me all wound up, I'm like, you know, but nevertheless. But, yeah, I there are there aren't too many more too many times in my life now, where I am meek, I'll use the word, because that was definitely where I was young when I was young much younger. But I've I recognize that this is who I am. And if people can't appreciate who I am, that's on them. Right? Like, it's on them. I'm not going to change, my identity to appease other people. I I went through a phase of doing that.

But it's funny you both bring this up because I you know, when people wanna book a consultation with me, they can go on my website, but it's called comm consultation. And I like, it just at that dining room table, right, Julie, at that table, it just came to me, and I'm like, I'm just gonna go with it. And I kept it. And every time I talk to someone, whenever they book it and we talk, inevitably, either at the end of that conversation or the beginning of a second conversation, they always say, Carrie, that you have it as calm consultation, and this was so calm. You were so chill. It I felt so good and relieved and, like, all is gonna be good in the world. And, like, that's really who I am. And so I've people have asked, like, are you gonna change that? And I'm like, you know? No.

No. I think it's really who it really is who I am.

So I'm gonna say something here. You may or may not pick up on this one, but it definitely you should be of the age where this made sense. But do you remember the old commercial EF Hutton?

I do.

When they speak, people listen. It was soft, direct. I feel like you got that's that insurance coming way back in the day bringing up so it's full circle. So look at that.

Look at that.

I didn't I didn't

know where you were gonna go with that.

I was because they never know and it always gives the tear on everybody.

Right. No. But I do remember that and I've had that experience. And, you know, that's another time when I was teaching that I I started to realize my voice. I remember I was in a meeting with this guy. He was a colleague, but he had contracts with National Geographic. And so I'm like, this big name, and he had a big voice. And I remember being in a meeting with him and some others, and I just sat back.

I'm like, I really like, it is what it is. These people are gonna talk themselves in circles, whatever. And so I wasn't speaking, and I remember distinctly, He goes, you know, we've been talking in circles. I'm really curious what Carrie has to say because she always has great insight. And I was like, what the and I said a couple expletives in my head. I'm like, what? And so I did. I just started talking. And while I looked around the table, I distinctly remember people kind of leaned in a little bit.

And so to your point, I yeah. It it's something that I've learned about myself. And when I'm in those high pressure ratcheting type

You've used it one time. You have 4 more this whole

day to use

that word. Another one. I got another one. Like, in those environments, instead of me ratcheting up my energy, I get more poised because I'm not the ratcheting type, and I'm able to limit everyone else's ratcheting energy. I got 4.

Oh, I feel like it's again, knowing your audience, of course, when you speak at National Geographic, you gotta talk quiet because the Serengeti wildebeest is getting eaten, and, of talk in a British accent. And of course, you gotta whisper so everybody's listening to hear. So you just know your audience. You did great on that.

Right. Right. Right. So I have 2 2 questions to wrap it up here. And my first question is, which I think we've talked about, but I just wanna confirm, what is your superpower?

My super I love this question. My superpower is listening to what is said as well as what is not said and being able to point that out to people in a way that makes them very comfortable.

I kind of wanted you to say the ability not to ratchet

up. I'm sorry.

I think that's what she was trying to say. I I that's what I heard. I know. That's what I heard.

Okay. So in layman terms, what I just said, my my superpower, Julie, I would say, I come with a red cape because I don't but I won't ratchet up. I won't ratchet up.

Thank you. I love that. We're gonna have to definitely use that. So then my final question is is what is your end game, doctor?

My end oh, my end game is my husband retired in December, he's very young. And so my endgame is that I am able to help as many people as I can changing their lives with learning. But in doing that on a personal level to live a peaceful life, peaceful life knowing that wherever I go, I'm doing good. Whether it's helping a farmer, building a home, just I I wanna live a peaceful life.

No ratcheting.

No ratcheting. I don't. I don't. I don't wanna plant ratchet seeds. None of it. I don't wanna wear ratchet clothes like none of it. I just wanna live a peaceful life and help others have peace as well.

Who knew we'd have such a strong vocabulary after this podcast?

Impressive. It really is. That's how it ends up.

But I think what you're saying, if I could sum summarize it, is there is no end game. You're gonna continue to do your passion and whatever it is that's ahead of you. You're gonna do it to the best of your ability, and, you're gonna do it calmly.

Yes.

Yes. Absolutely.

Well, Carrie, would you like to give a little plug to your company in case people wanna get ahold of you?

Yes. For all of you small business owners out there who are looking to improve either your coaching program or your employee onboarding, I encourage you to schedule a comm consultation with me on my website, www.drcarriegraham.com, and let's just chat about what you need and and share with me where you wanna go.

Awesome. We really appreciate you being on the show today. You've learned a few new words. Life's good. A couple good stories. So thank you very much for your time. This is Empowering Entrepreneurs Podcast. I'm Glenn Harper.

Julie Smith.