The Power of Delegating and Investing in High-Value Tasks

Hello, everybody. Welcome to another edition, the Empowering Entrepreneurs podcast. I'm Glenn Harper.

Julie Smith.

What's going on, Julie?

You know, it's still warm here, and it's supposed to be cold, so I'm gonna take it.

It's a beautiful day in Ohio, fall day. We don't get many of these, but this is why you live in Ohio.

Maybe.

Well, I mean, Maybe maybe summertime, but fall is just gorgeous. Got the crisp mornings, beautiful fall foliage, and the football. What more could one ask for?

Probably our guest today.

Well, there you go. What's that great segue, Julie? So we've got, I'd like to introduce, Phil Wittman, a fellow CPA, Means certified public accountant, Anas CPA, c e p a, which is a certified exit planning adviser who not only eats, sleeps, and drinks tax code and FASB standards, But love's to empower other CPAP firms to achieve their potential. He's the founder and owner of Whitman Trusted Advisors. C Suite Impact is on the board of many of a company that fill a chair with an account looking type guy. In all seriousness, Phil is at the is in the top 100 most influential people in accounting and is the man when it comes to bringing Being an authority on helping CPay firms rise above their competition with not only better leadership within the company, but deliver a better client experience. Growing a CPF firm is hard, and Phil has made that look easy. Thanks, Phil, for being on our show.

Oh, you're welcome, Glenn. And, wow, I am just so impressed. You guys, you could do this full time. I

No. That wouldn't be fun then.

No. It's it's so hard to, you know, when we get We every once in a while, we get lucky and get a really, a guest that just stands on in a different way. Everybody's got their own thing, but, Phil, I think you're a little bit different. And, you know, we always like to get to know our our our guests a little bit. And, you know, you're impossible to find it. You've Got yourself locked down. I tapped in the NSA, and I couldn't find anything on you out there, personally or, you know, sins from your past that are fun to talk about. But, I do know that your birthday's in April.

And how the heck do you manage that in tax season?

Oh my goodness. You know, the one good thing is none of my kids were born in April. But, and my birthday was April 6th, and I was a tax guy. I guess I got out at a good point in time. You know? I was a senior tax accountant and had a client that was lien and levied by the IRS in New York State and my firm sent me in to go in and straighten them out, and that's how my practice management career was born. It was Originally with a, a law firm whose, controller, went to Israel, sent a fax. She couldn't take the pressure. She wasn't coming back.

And

Here you are.

It's amazing the way things start. And I can remember my old firm saying, Phil, you're making a really big mistake. We make partners here at a really young age, and that law firm you're going to, you know, they don't have any money. They're all Screwed up. And I was newly married, and it was different. It was fun. And I was running a law suite, and, you know, it, it really, ultimately, was transformational. And a very interesting thing, That managing partner, to this day, is a client at, Whitman Transition Advisors, and He was one of the ones that took a private equity investment.

I meet with him every month, and, it's it's just, The way things come full circle, it's it's just pretty amazing.

Funny how things work out, isn't it? You know, it's one of these the the the fun part about is to try to figure out how you got where you got. And, you know, where were you where were you raised? Where'd you grow up at?

So I I was born in Brooklyn, but, you know, my parents moved out to suburbs in New Jersey, by the time I was 2 years old so I grew up in a small town, Matawan, New Jersey, Central Jersey. My high school produced some, tremendous football players, Madam One Regional High School, And a couple of guys that joined the, the Dallas cowboys. One of my classmates was, you know, Kansas City Chiefs, but you know how it goes with football players. What is it? An average of, 2 seasons and 4 games Before an injury

and 2.3. Yep. Mhmm.

Yeah. 2.3. So, but in any event, You know, I I I grew up, and I literally today live about 4 miles from the home that I was raised in. And, it's it's just a nice bedroom community in Monmouth County, New Jersey.

And it seems like, you know, The ability I think you went to Rutgers, which is a great school. I mean, I don't know how you feel about getting in the Big Ten when they did, but it's pretty cool that, you know, the Big Ten goes sea to shining sea. But, you know, you were economics degree. So how did you transition from economics to accounting?

Dad was always my idol. He would come home from work and tell these amazing stories of Who he went to lunch with and where he went to lunch and the you know, one of the things that that I'd say, And I'm a I'm passionate about this profession, and, it it's just that we've done a terrible job Of educating the young folks, what an amazing, amazing career and profession this is. And I think it's because Those, dinner table stories, aren't being told, and there's a lot of secrets that are being kept. We just did a very bad job of educating the young folks what a what an amazing profession it is. I mean, I literally went into it because Those compelling stories that I heard from my dad, I was like, okay. That's what I wanna do.

Well, you know, just talking with you, you're not the, quote, stereotypical CPA, which She's very reserved and deep thinking and and stoic, and you don't talk, and you're buttoned up. And, like, that's how that's how they usually roll, and and nobody wants to be like Yeah. But I think the industry is definitely changing. I think you're trying to change it. We're trying to change it. And the you can actually be an accountant and be a real person and talk and have a good time time and and help people, but people just don't see it that way for some reason. It's a horrible marketing campaign.

Well and I think for the young younger generation, they're so scared of it because of that tax season. They the younger generation really wants that work life balance, and no one's out there setting the record straight that you can have both.

Yeah. And I think there are some middle market and smaller firms that have done an amazing job of rolling out the red carpet. I think the biggest challenge we face is we all know that the big four hire about 75 to 80% of all accounting graduates, And their professors are typically saying, you know, go to the big four because that's what they know, and most of them never worked in public accounting. And, yes, at the big four, you'll get a great training in years 1, 2, and 3, but then you'll be highly Specialized, you know, an inch wide and a mile deep. And when you look to transition to a middle market firm, if you're at the manager level, You know, sometimes it's a little bit of a challenge. But I think that the smaller and middle market firms, That's the that's the way to go. Because what happens, the big four hires all these people. They work them to death 80, a 100 hours, a week.

And they think this is what public accounting is about, and they leave and they never come back. I'm I'm working with a partner, someone who spent 40 years at a big four firm, and he just joined one of our Strategics. And as you know, nowadays in the m and a arena, it's not just CPA firm to CPA firm. We just closed a transaction with a wealth management fund. You know? And I'm sure we all saw, you know, the, the the Bergen firm that did a deal with, creative solutions, creative management, whoever it was. But we have all these new buyers in the marketplace, And this big four partner that I'm working with, as he's now been meeting small and middle market firms For potential investment by this giant wealth management group, he's like, we were so insular. All we know is the big four. And now I'm finding out that there's a whole another world.

And, you know so he had to retire at 60.

Mhmm.

And I used to think 60 was old un until I turned 60. And When I look at it, you know, as I mentioned, dad was a partner at Price Waterhouse. He was fortunate they extended him 2 years. He worked on a very large Mutual fund, and they were gonna go out to bid unless they had Whitman. So, he stayed on, had 1 client for 2 years. But even still, I'm gonna be 62 next April. And at 62, my dad Face mandatory retirement. I just feel like I am so vibrant.

I have so much more to give. And, you know, if I have Health you know, to just continue helping CPAs and firms, I I I just can't imagine. And I know one of the challenges. I go into firms. I have a firm I'm working with in in in in Naples, Florida, a 90 year old practitioner. And he's got great clients, and it's small. It's a $1,000,000 book of business, but he's looking he thinks it's time for him to begin to change. Hold on a little bit.

Yeah. Yeah. He still wants the work, though. And he does all the work. He does all the returns. And, you know, I know that for Affirm, we don't want those young kids coming in and seeing 80 90 year olds walking around Because they're gonna think, oh my goodness. If I'm in this profession, is that what I'm gonna have to be doing when I'm 80 or 90? But the reality is We're not digging ditches. We're not breaking our backs.

Our hands are in callous. And as long as you have your brain, You know, this is a profession that I think it will enable you to stay lively. And I think, unfortunately, I've seen too many of my colleagues, partners that they stop, and it's when they stop, that they're It's over.

It's over. Good.

To wash. You know?

Well, Phil, I'm gonna go back 50 years. I'm gonna switch this dial. So go back 50 years, and you have these great idols that you look up to that do are doing great things, creating amazing stories. What did you do in your childhood? Were you just a natural entrepreneur as well? And you, you know, what did you do in your childhood that maybe could have impacted where you are today?

You know, very, very perceptive of you, Julie. And and I you know what? You bring me back. So when I was probably 7 years old, I used to get this, You know, in the magazine, it used to have all these offers in the back and send the self addressed stand, you know, pay for shipping and handling. So I walked my neighborhood, and there was the American Seed Company. I sold seeds, Flower seeds and vegetable seeds. When it snowed outside, me and my brothers, what we would do, we would walk around our neighborhood, And we would knock on doors, and we'd say, oh, we'll shovel your driveway for $5 or $10 depending how big it was. And we would hit every house, And we would get their commitment that we would be doing the shoveling. And, obviously, you could only shovel 1 driveway at a time.

But when the next kid went there, they said, oh, you know, we already hired Phil and David to do it. So, like, we you know, so I shoveled Snow. I mowed lawns. Even when I was in the public accounting profession, I always had a side business. You know? And it wasn't a tax practice. I did have a tax practice. I mean, I had a travel agency. I used to book people.

And, actually, that was the firm when they sent me to a law firm to help them out. That's how my practice management career was born. So, you know, I I'm gonna stop for a second, but I'm gonna remember to to add something else because I think So much of who you are and what you become is is is a matter of mindset. And you either have an open mindset. You have a mindset of doom and gloom. And in the past, I've done a series, with With Don Hood, I call it the fearful mindset. And I think in the public accounting industry, unfortunately, Too many of our brethren have that fearful mindset.

Ultra conservative. You you bring a couple amazing points that, As our listeners who are we believe are mostly entrepreneurs is the fact that if you're gonna do something, you gotta go all in. And you went all in. And you you got the commitment. You did it. And, you know, sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. You didn't actually fail. You just pivoted and did something else.

And you had a great support staff around you, meeting your family and friends to help you do that. People believed in you. A lot of entrepreneurs don't have that, and it makes it really, really challenging. But as as you mentioned fried chicken, I could go for some honey you know, spicy honey, chicken right now. That sounds really good. Oh my god. And you said something, a little bit earlier as well. You know, when you were young and you Wait.

Wait. Wait. Go ahead. Before you go back again. I wanna stay in the moment we're in. And I think, Phil, a lot of entrepreneurs see the peaks And the valleys and the peaks and the valleys. And I think usually people get stuck in those valleys. But I think to your point and your story is you learned how to crawl out of the peak or crawl out of the valley to get to the next peak.

You never wanted to stay down there. You knew you couldn't. And I think your mindset what you said about mindset is what's propelled you forward in your career and in your life. And I think that's a huge thing for entrepreneurs listening is don't stay where you are too long. Right? Don't don't wallow in that. Figure out How to pivot, how to get out of it, and, hey, maybe you go from fried chicken to, QuickBooks. I don't know how that works, but sound sounds great.

Yeah. The next day is another day, and go up and slay it.

Instead of it kind of enjoying being with my newlywed bride and saying, okay. When next in my life am I gonna have A break. Now we did go to Bar Harbor, and we had some adventures while I was looking. But but the thing that I would tell you, I was, like, So laser beam focused on putting myself out there and and doing you know you know, not laying on the couch and crying. So so, yes, those peaks and valleys. And and I did you know, I I I kind of experienced Another valley, you know, my my foraying into practice management, I started with law firms. I spent 6 years Helping law firms as their COO. And then I said, I'm a CPA.

What the heck?

Dad Working at this $6,000,000 firm, you're a partner at Price Waterhouse. These guys, they, you know, they're making 5, $600,000 each. He said, yeah. Just because it's a big floor firm Doesn't mean you make more money than all the you know, there's plenty of smaller firms. What I've learned is public accounting has probably created more millionaires next store than our world knows about. And I think part of the thing and and, look, it's not all about the money, But you you know you know that thing they say money can't buy you happiness? Well, someone once said, yeah, but it makes the miserable times a little bit more easy to handle.

Absolutely.

But but what what I can tell you is some of the young folks out there, if they only realize the inheritance that has been created for them in the public accounting arena. You know? And and and there are entrepreneurial CPAs and CPA firms out there. And, you know, it it's just it it's such there's such an amazing opportunity. And I was I was glad to see the other day, accounting today, and you had mentioned that accounting enrollment was up at Purdue University. I, myself, because I graduated from Rutgers, I've agreed to mentor couple of students, that are in the business school there. I've gone to, local high schools to talk about what an amazing, career this could be because I did audit. I did tax. I went into private.

I ran restaurants. I ran law firms. I ran CPA firms, and now 15 years Consulting with CPA firms I mean, e even if you just go and get an accounting degree and a CPA license, You're golden for the rest of your life no matter what you do. So

Yeah. It's it's funny. As a role as a CPA, if you're at a a like, a big four, you like you said, you're gonna know 1 piece for probably 1 or 2 clients, and it's very You'll know the knowledge of that piece, but when you work in a smaller firm and you're dealing with clients, you get to see everything. And so you're when you do the tax sweatshop Saying for those 1st few years, you learn so much about everything that your knowledge base is so long, and you just You look and see what other people are doing, what they're doing right, what they're doing wrong, gives you a little bit more of an opportunity to to understand if you're gonna be an entrepreneur. This is what you look for. You get to you got to see all these clients, what they did right, what they did wrong. It's like your own little mutual fund. You get to pull the best out of it.

And I think that's probably what you were doing. Right? And And sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. Right? If we had a you know, for every success, there's another one that just didn't make it. But it for you, when you were doing this, like, There had to be a calling. And was it the fact that when you went and were changed that firm and you were like, wait a minute. I'm seeing what People are making, was it the money opportunity, or was it the opportunity to expand what you know and help others? What what made you switch from wanting to work for the man to being the man?

So, you know, I I guess I've always, I've always had very thick Scan and had the ability to let things roll off my shoulder. And I'm sure if you imagine when you're in a role and whether they call you the director of administration, chief operating officer, Or or a firm administrator.

You're like barista.

She's barista.

Barista. There you go. And you can do that too. You you deal with a lot of things. I mean, everything comes across your plate. And it's and so, a, Being a person that liked having a seat at the table and having my hands in so many different things, It was just, I guess, the the variety that I wasn't sitting there and, you know, I wasn't Troller or CFO closing out, you know, month after month, being the orchestra leader of, an administrative team, You know? And giving my partner group the ability to do what they do best. So I've always been a people person. You know? Someone comes in your office, they're upset.

You gotta calm them down. You gotta be a little bit of a psychologist. You know? And, you know, when do you invoke the 72 hour rule, which is, yeah, I understand you. Let's get together, you know, on Monday. And clearly, By Monday, everything has kinda calmed down, and we don't have to deal with you know, take take harsh action. But in any event, I think it was the diversity of of, you know, just running a business, and I always did it in such a way that, Hey. I could save you money. I'm a tax guy.

The 1st firm I went into, you know, unfortunately, they were able to hey. We don't need you to Prepare the tax return and do all this accounting work. All we need you to do is review it because Fella's gonna do this now. You know? So I always went into these roles with the idea of I'm going to be a profit center for you because It's gonna ultimately end up costing you nothing to have made because I'm gonna save you money and waste that you'd never thought of. I always went in As if I was the outsider, a consulting coming in and looking under the hood and being a fixer. And then I felt like when I fixed things, it was time to move on. So I went from a $6,000,000 firm to an $18,000,000 firm, and it was all health care and not for profits. And I helped them grow to 30,000,000, and then I got a Paul and someone said, I got a $60,000,000 firm for you.

And, you know, I joined that firm, and after 6 years helped them grow to a 100,000,000. We went from 300 people to 400 people, 38 partners to 48 partners, and then a series of life events. And I think there's always something that puts you, into, whether it's your true north direction or another direction. My mom was diagnosed with multiple myeloma. My middle son who was 10 years old, was diagnosed. He had a very large, arachnoid cyst, on the left temporal lobe of his brain. And here I am running a firm that's almost a 100,000,000 in revenue, and I'm going to world class brain surgeons and cancer treatment centers. And I had an amazing team.

And that amazing team was able to even if I didn't come in until 3 or 4 PM to get the The stuff I needed to get done, things were operating seamlessly. Almost so seamlessly that in my mind, I was thinking these guys are I think, what do we need Phil for? But in any event, you know, my mom passed away after a 1 year battle with multiple myeloma. My son, thank goodness. And to this day, you know, the the event, which I believe was, You know, amusement park rides rattling the brain a little bit too much that caused, you know, a a little this is something congenital he was born with. But, you know, everything's settled down. And I was laying in bed 1 night, And my oldest son it was the night before his middle school graduation. And I said to My wife I can't believe Charlie's going to, high school next year. And she sat up and she looked at me, and she said, what? Are you kidding? You're missing it all.

You leave, it's dark. You come home, it's dark. And the truth of the matter is I had become my father. My dad was a workaholic. He dedicated his life to, Price Waterhouse, and he He came to maybe 1, Little League Baseball game of mine because he was always working Saturdays, Sundays. But then again, sometimes I think maybe it was because I really I I wasn't an a player. You know? Maybe if Maybe if I wasn't a bench warmer or or maybe if I was a first stringer, he would have been at my gates. But, no, all kidding aside, Dad work.

I had become my dad. And the truth of the matter is I would go to work, I'd fall asleep on the train, and I'd wake up, and I wouldn't know if I was going to work or coming home from work. And that evening when my wife sat up in bed was pivotable because we were like ships passing in the night, And I could have been a statistic. I'm gonna be married 33 years next June. And I said, you know what? I'm gonna go in, And I'm gonna tell them I'm leaving. I have no idea what I'm gonna do, but I'm gonna let them know after October 15th, and this was in June, I'm gonna leave the firm. And, you know, I ended up leaving the firm. I took a month off because I had just built, You know, the $1,000,000 interest only McMansion on a hill in, you know, Edroom community.

You're back in the game.

I'm back in the game, and, and and I decided to do that because one of my former partners who had left my firm called me up, and he said, Phil, with 3,000,000, you know, I left as a solo. I joined 2 other guys with 12 people. I can't take on a new Client, I'm having trouble hiring staff. Maybe you could introduce us to managing partners. So I started doing that, But then I realized deal cycle was so long, I wasn't gonna be able to pay my $1,000,000 interest only mortgage. So I started doing Some lateral partner talent acquisition. And I realized, okay. That's gonna be how, you know, every 2 or 3 months, we earn a See, I'm able to pay my bills.

Now I will tell you, I've often thought of doing, like, an infomercial. You know? Like, Come visit my house. You know, you see the guy in front of the Ferrari. I don't have a Ferrari, but, you know, the swimming pool. You know? I'm still in the house Despite the fact that along the way, I got notice of foreclosure a notice of intent to foreclose from the bank Least a half a dozen times. I'd fall 3 months behind. I closed a deal. I would then get caught up, and I'd be good for 3 months.

And then, you know, it was those peaks and valleys. You know? And, I would come home from a great day in the city, which was, I got to meet a managing partner today, and he said he wants to work with me. And my wife would be like, you know, the movie, Jerry Maguire. Show me the money, Jerry. Show me the money. Did you make a bank deposit today? Well, what Maybe.

I'm trying. I'm trying.

Day. You know? But We would go back to where she'd be like, you need to get a job, and I'd say I'm building a business. And she'd say you need to get a job. And then my old firm Called me up one day, and they said, oh, you know, because they were had become a client of of ours, and the managing partner was retiring. And the two Guys that ultimately became co managing partners, they each had, like, $4,000,000 books of business, and they were Started running the firm on Saturdays, you know, in the Long Island office, and they asked me if I would come back, bring me in as a Partner. When I was COO, I wasn't a partner. My dream was always to be a partner in a CPA firm. And I still, to this day, have the contracts in my drawer, And it was gonna be a very nice retirement benefit.

By the way, they recently folded into Citroen Cooperman, so there was a very big payday. And I'm sure I would've participated in that. But, ultimately, I told them, you know what? I love The one to many. Helping many. You know, when I was at that firm, I always felt like, what good am I really doing in the world? I'm helping 48 partners become extremely wealthy. But then I would say, okay. We have 400 people. We're all putting food on their table.

You can measure things different ways. But, You know, I truly found my, my my passion. I mean, I love helping people. Sometimes people think I'm crazy. I was on the phone with a managing partner yesterday. You know, we recently launched this new offshoring company where we're consulting with firms, and our chief fractional, Outsourcing officer, as we call him, instead of CEO. It's a company we started, Impact, Global Solutions Group. We're the only, firm, consulting with CPA firms how to do offshoring and outsourcing the right way.

So it's not about when we first got into the, offshoring business, we have a partnership with a company in the Philippines. We had heard Sue Coffey at the AICPA say that there aren't gonna be enough auditors go around with all these PPPs and governmental grants. So we went to the Philippines. We formed a partnership with a company that had almost a 100 people deployed to a charter accountancy firm in Australia. Now they get their CPA in the Philippines. They were having trouble breaking into the US. We now have a 100 people deployed at 10 CPA firms. And when we did it, we did it in such a way that we weren't gonna mark it up and make Crazy money on it.

I feel like you've read our script. You kinda hit all the high points, and and I wanna highlight a couple of those. Yeah. At some point, you're probably gonna be a client Of Whitman transition advisers to get you transition out, which is kind of ironic. But I think one of the things you said earlier I wanna bring back, which which is important for our listeners, is that you were fortunate enough that you had The accounting tax advisory experience. So you were able to navigate your own journey kinda doing it yourself. You probably got some help from other I would imagine a little bit, but mostly, you kinda knew it because of your experience. But most entrepreneurs don't have that experience.

They just have their idea. It is very important, and I think you would agree, that if you're an entrepreneur, you really need not just a tax or accountant person. You need that adviser that's bringing you value, That's gonna show you the secrets and the shortcuts. And you ultimately had that, but our our listeners, that's that's the secret sauce generally because just Then the tax savings alone and the efficiencies of your operations, if you're you're making a 100,000 a year and somebody can save you 15, $20 in taxes, That is literally that's life changing for somebody at that level. If you're making a million a year and somebody can save you a couple 100,000, that's life changing. That value, You people think you pay for that. It's an expense. But like you said, it's really an investment.

So I think that's one thing that you you've touched on, but, again, you You did it from a different perspective because you kinda knew all those things. Right? You've already had the experience. But most most most people, entrepreneurs, don't have that. The second

Entrepreneurs need that team. And and and, Glenn, I frequently call that, How do you give yourself a raise? Mhmm. You can give yourself a raise just by bringing in the right adviser, the right team around you. You know, you need someone to be the quarterback. You know? Great ideas. You know? Look, e even myself. I never could have done this myself. Yep.

I have a I have a partner who, yeah, there were things. You know, I'm I'm an outside guy. I'm a visionary. But you know what? All the fine details that help you get where you really wanna go to, I'm I'm I'm not that, you know, guy on the ground, the detail guy. So, you you know, there's Complimentary skill sets, and you need that team. You need that quarterback that can help you put that team together.

Hey. Your your biggest expense, it there's really 2 things. It's like how much you spend in your business knowing Well, you think it's gonna keep working, but it might not. You need to pivot and change it. Right? So you keep dumping, pulling money out of retirement. A lot of entrepreneurs do that. Before you do that, have that evaluation, the Time, money, effort for the results to know that take the emotion out of it. Look at it like a business.

Your adviser can help you with that. Your biggest expense if you're making money is taxes. You can get a raise without having to change anything other than just being more efficient. Right? So so I think you've touched you hit that one on the head. The second thing you did, which was really cool, is, you know, You get so caught up in you know, our parents, they just were because that's what they did. They didn't know any better. I mean, that's how it went. We were lucky in our generation.

Again, you're way older than I am, so it's a little different for you. I'm totally messed with you. You're almost qualified for Social Security here soon. But

In April. Yes.

Get it give it up. So what'll happen is that we were fortunate to learn that, wait a minute. That's how we started our careers, And then we realized, wait a minute. That's that's not cool. You were lucky that you were able to listen to the people around you that said, hey. You gotta back off because this is not sustainable. And for whatever reason, nobody an entrepreneur doesn't like what doing what they're told. They like doing what they wanna do.

Right? But However it was marketed to you, you were able to go, wait a minute. That's right. And, again, you're probably working harder, but you're working smarter, I'm guessing. And the hours are just different. It's not the grind. It's the bigger picture things. And as an entrepreneur, you made the transition from Doing business to building businesses, and that's way different. That's way more funner.

You you hit it on the head. Went from doing everything to focusing on the highest value use of my time By by bringing in people who you know, all those other things much better in their hands than mine. And, yes, working on the business as opposed to in the business.

What age were you when you made that transition? When it finally hit you with the 2 by 4 to the forehead, did that happen? Go, wait a minute. What am I doing here?

Glenn and his HR questions.

I love it.

No. So so so that is a great question. So do you remember the days, Glenn, when it was in vogue to say, I'm amazing at multitasking. You know? I I I I was, like, better than the the the Ringling Brothers and Barnum and Bailey clown that was, you know, juggling 5 or 6 balls. You know? I had Funny things up in the air. But the reality is everyone now knows that when you got 20 things up in the air, you know, You got 20 things in various stages of, disarray and incompletion. You know? You you're supposed to single mind things. So I would say I'm 61.

And I think many entrepreneurs, they're so entrenched in the business because they don't have the resources and the help that they need so that they can focus on the business. So so

the question that comes to mind then is 2 things. 1, everybody listening, it's never too late too late to make that transition. Look at this guy. He's been doing this, Quote, a way for 40 years, and all of a sudden in the last 5 years, the light switch clicks, and here he goes. What do you think? It was it a Life changing event that pushed you that direction. Was it the sudden realization, the moment? But what you know, there's a trigger, and and what we're trying to do is figure out all these other entrepreneurs that are out there that are struggling. How do we get them to open up that curtain and go, oh my god. That's the answer over there? I had no idea.

How do you get them to take that step over there? What was your kick that said, oh my god. This is crazy. Was it because of the hours? What what do you think it was?

You know, I think for a long time, I resisted. You know? My my my partner was telling me, You know, you really need to get an administrative assistant. You know, I was I I grew up in a law firm arena where, you know, the attorneys, you know, they did their own memos. It wasn't like Every attorney had a legal secretary. I mean, there was a pool of them that, you know, 20 attorneys shared. You know, obviously, there are other environments where, you know, it was like a one to 1 relationship, you know, or an attorney and associate sharing. So So so the reality is, you know, I, for the longest time, believed that I'm self sufficient. I could I could handle this.

I could do the billing. The reality is I was living the e myth. You know? I had my administrative days. I had my sales days. I had my work days. But the reality is when you try and do it all on your own, you're doing yourself a disservice. And, yes, when you first start out, The 1st year, you know, you do that because that's what you do when you start a business. But I think if you get yourself educated and realize that You gotta put together that team.

And short term pain, long term gain, yeah, you'll make a little bit less. You know, it will cost you money, but, you know, the old dash, you know, it takes money to make money. Reality is you gotta make that investment. And and what I could tell you, there were years where once I made that decision, Like, I could've put my arms around and not done that and made a lot more money, But the reality was it was trying to I I think it's just believe that it's possible. You know? And and sometimes it's going against you know, because you're so accustomed to, I don't need it. I can do it. But the reality is, you know, once you get into your zone and I mean, I'll give you a perfect example. After October 16th, the, you know, the tax filing deadline, I just looked at the calendar.

I said there's 75 days until we ring in the new year. And I made a public goal to to my entire team. I said in the next 75 days, even though I don't work Friday, Saturday, or Sunday, I My 3 day weekend every week, I'm gonna do 75 meetings between now and the end of the year. And then I said, okay. 75 merger meetings. And I want 37 of them to be with new potential sellers or people that are looking to take an investment. And, I made that announcement publicly to the team. We are tracking it.

I think I have 46 meetings to go between now and the end of the year. We figured out I have 2 meetings a day that I need to do to achieve that goal. And it's not just any meeting. It's meetings with people that have raised their hand and said, I wanna do this. Now if I was focusing on all the other, oh, man, I gotta I gotta do payroll, and I gotta do this, and I gotta do that, I'd be lucky if I got in, you know You know, 1 or 2 meetings a week. You know? So I I think getting in that zone and and I think, You know, have a goal. Have a goal and, and write those goals down because most people don't write them down. You you know what, Glenn? I think, the difference between, like, a true entrepreneur And and someone that's just, in a business.

Like, I'm sure you see partners in CPA firms, And many of them, and I meet with plenty of them, they don't act like business owners.

Never.

They they they they act like, you know, they're a glorified employee that makes a lot of money. They've never known what it's like to, Oh, man. I gotta call this client, that client, and the other client because I don't have enough money to make payroll this week. And, oh, Since I don't have enough, I'm not gonna take payroll. And and I think for the entrepreneur, I think there really has to be a, you know, that internal drive and that that it says, I can do this. I think too many people get off the merry-go-round too soon. They don't realize exactly how close they are to success.

So close.

And they and they give up, and they quit. And, you know, there's so many people, you know, whether you look like a failure or not.

No. No worries. Like that f word.

We never use the f word. That that we can't use the word. It's funny. The accounts that we always I love poking fun of accounts being 1 and all. And, Julie, she gets I get a lot of, abuse on her on my behalf of being 1, but accountants are great. We just do whatever we did last year, and that's what we do. And we we think like accountants. We don't think like entrepreneurs and business owners, and we truly are.

And if we operate our business like that, it's gonna be a better experience for our team. It's gonna be a better experience for the entrepreneurs or our clients. And so you just gotta change my we know the secrets. We watched our clients do it. We advise them. We tell them what to do. We literally give them the blueprint, but a lot of times, we don't take it ourselves. So That was good that you did that.

They just before, we didn't have Like, if you didn't have a bunch of people you went to Harvard with, you're not gonna learn the secrets of what the wealthy people do. Today, you go find it out in 2 seconds.

So I have I have 2 questions for you as we're ending our time here. My first one is, Phil, what is your superhero superpower?

I would say my superpower Is the ability to take a bad situation and see the silver lining in the cloud And and and just not let it, hamper whether it's a relationship. My dad used to tell me when Pricewaterhouse he was in the New York office. When there was a client that they were on the verge of losing, they would send my dad in Because dad was blessed with diplomacy intact. And and and dad, I would say he wasn't like me in terms of being an entrepreneur. He was at Pricewaterhouse his entire career, And he loved what he did, and he loved every minute of it. But he was the guy filled with diplomacy intent, And I think I was blessed. It must be genetic. I talked to some of his old partners now, and they're like, oh, if I close my eyes, it's It's like I'm talking to your dad.

So I I think it's and I have you know, every once in a while, whether it's a dissatisfied client or a client that thinks he's dissatisfied Mhmm. But doesn't realize that there are things that he's not doing, Or she's not doing to, to make things happen, whether it's getting a deal across the finish line. So I think it's My my real strengths are shoot bullets through me. They bounce right off. Everything rolls off my shoulders. I I have, and my dad coined this term. I don't know if you ever have heard this. And, unfortunately, my dad passed away in 21.

He he was my superhero, but, he said because he talked about stress, and he said, I'm worried about you. You work so hard. Work harder than anyone I know. You need to slow down. So, you know, He said stress is gonna kill you. And I said, dad, I have no stress, absolutely no stress. He said, come on, Philip. Everyone has stress.

He said, ah, I got it. He said, you have enjoyable stress. And the reality is I have enjoyable stress. I love what I do. I love every minute of my day. I never feel like I'm working. You know? And so when my wife says to me, you know, when are you thinking about retiring? And she's caring for her elderly mom who has dementia. You know? So we all got things.

I said, I don't know. But as long as you're, you know, caring for your mom, you know, I'm gonna keep doing what I'm doing. But the reality is if I have my health I mean, I could see myself doing this well into my seventies because I love what I do, and there's no stress. And I never feel like I'm working. I always feel like I am helping people.

I'm gonna start calling you, Winston Wolfe from Pulp Fiction. You're the guy that comes in and cleans stuff up. It's the best.

So I have I have 1 last question, and you kind of answered it. But I also think you gotta take it a step further for our listeners. What is your end game?

Under c suite impact, we have, 11 companies, everything from a fractional CFO business, which was started to help our CPA PA firm clients that were doing audits that, you know, couldn't do that work if their client lost the CFO. You know, we don't do audit. We don't do tax. You know, we figured it would be a natural. And so we have a Fractional CFO business. We have, Impact Business Builders that helps people that are 3 to 5 years away from retirement. We have 5 recruiting companies. We have impact legal resources.

It's part of the C suite impact group of companies, and we'll do a private equity, event. My My partner tells me we should wait until, you know, we could get a multiple that'll ultimately End up being in the 50 or $60,000,000 range. Look. There's You know, if I live another 25 years, I I'll consider myself blessed. You can never spend all that money in a lifetime. You know, I am very charitable. My mailman probably thinks, what's wrong with this guy? Because, you you know, I made a mistake, you know, for Last year toward towards the end of the year, I said, alright. You know, I wanna, you know, make a whole bunch of charitable contributions.

And anyone that sent me, you know, a solicitation, if it seemed like a reasonable mission, I made a contribution or I made a monthly contribution. And they must have sold my name because every day, I get at least 20 solicitations. And my wife said, you have to stop. You can't give to everybody. So So then I said, okay. You know what we're gonna do? We're gonna take all the ones that we get. And at the end of the week, you know, I have 3 sons. The 5 of us are gonna decide.

Which one of the 30 or 40 we got this week we're gonna make a contribution to? But, you know, my you know, I think there will be an exit. I I think it will be with a strategic that wants to continue to have relationships with what I call The keeper of the golden goose, and that's the CPA, because, you know, the the golden goose that keeps on giving, and there's Such tremendous entrepreneurial opportunities for the CPA firm, which I believe is already on the verge of becoming a multidisciplinary Consulting organization, and, I'm just quite surprised all these strategics Took so long to wake up and realize, but it's kind of with the with the baby boomer, owners of CPA firms. It's the white night that's coming in at the 11th hour, and there's never been a better time To be a CPA or CPA firm that hasn't planned well for transition. But I I believe, like the CPAs we work with, our exit will be with a strategic.

I think Julie's got you trapped. Go ahead, Julie.

So, Phil, I I love your answer. It's very well thought out, and I don't not think that's gonna happen. But I also don't think Phil Wittman can stop after that exit strategy. I think there's something else on the horizon as long as you have your health and your your driving ambition. I don't think that's going away. So I

It ain't gonna happen.

I can't wait to hear about that exit, Sid. And then I can't wait to, revisit your your next thing.

Sucked back in. Yeah.

It's in my DNA. That's it. Well This has been wonderful. I I really appreciate you Bringing up, you know, lot of thoughts going through my head in having this conversation with both of you.

Well, you Thank you enough,

Julie and Glenn. Absolute pleasure meeting you.

Well, you 2, we've been a wonderful guest. We appreciate your insight. And I I know our our Our, listeners are gonna glean a lot of nuggets out of this one. So we really appreciate it, and I'm sure our paths will cross again, as you keep, Keep going and doing great things. So we wish you the best.

Thank you so much